TANTANGAN MUSLIM: BUKTIKAN MUHAMAD SUNAT

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Re: TANTANGAN MUSLIM: BUKTIKAN MUHAMAD SUNAT

Postby 11/9-wtc » 2009 10 04, 5:54

Kembali ke topik...

Muhammad TIDAK DISUNAT alias masih KULUP! :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Kenalilah Tuhan, Allahmu dengan benar; Sebab ramai orang beragama tidak mengenal Tuhan... Kasihan sekali. Image
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Re: TANTANGAN MUSLIM: BUKTIKAN MUHAMAD SUNAT

Postby luv_nice » 2009 10 04, 11:00

kang_erry wrote:lho siapa presiden disini? Musa Atau Ibrahim kalau presiden itu musa karena yang nulis musa maka memang berlakunya untuk bani israel, memang musa diutus buat siapa?

Musa menuliskan apa yg terjadi pada masa Ibrahim.
Sama seperti gubernur Jatim menyampaikan apa yg disampaikan Presiden.


Bani israel or Bani ismael?, kalau itu ibrahim ya buktikan dulu di ayat mana ibrahim berkata seperti itu dan di kitab apa.

Jelas ada di kitab Kejadian yg ditulis memang pada masa hidup Musa.
Keturunan Ishak memang memegang teguh perjanjian Tuhan yg disampaikan kepada Abraham. Jadi meski sampai pada masa Musa, kisah itu masih bisa disampaikan dgn detil.
Nah kalau ternyata bani Ismael lupa dgn kisah itu, jelas itu urusan internal Ismael dan keturunannya. Tapi bodoh banget jika kemudian para pendukung keturunan Ismael lantas menyalahkan keturunan Ishak.


jadi analogi anda tidak tepat karena bani israel berbeda dengan bani ismael dan masing masing nabi punya syariat dan aturan teknis tertentu

Ngomong tanpa dipikir ya begini ini.
Tolong ditegaskan dulu deh. Sunatnya muslim pakai aturan Ibrahim atau aturan muhammad.
Aturan teknis siapa yg dipakai?
Kalau ngaku mengikuti aturan Abraham ya jgn ngotot, bani Ishak punya aturan yg detil ttg hal itu, sebagaimana dulu diterima Ibrahim dr Tuhan.




Yang dikatakan Paulus adalah GUNANYA sunat dalam hal KESELAMATAN. Bukan maslah kesehatan dll.
Sunat semula adalah tanda perjanjian. Maka yg tidak sunat berarti tidak mengimani perjanjian Tuhan.
Tapi ketika janji itu sudah ditepati Tuhan, maka tanda perjanjian itu tidak perlu lagi.
Org yg ngeyel bersunat dengan alasan sbg tanda perjanjian sama artinya tidak mengakui Tuhan telah melunasi janjiNya.


apa buktinya? memangnya anda bisa buktiin paulus tau gunanya sunat bagi kesehatan?

Tolong matanya dibuka lebar2. Saya tidak bilang Paulus bicara ttg kesehatan.
Justru saya katakan Paulus bicara ttg manfaat sunat untuk KESELAMATAN.
BUKAN MASALAH KESEHATAN.



inlah bedanya nabi muhammad dengan paulus, anda tau sesuatu yang besar itu di mulai dari hal yang kecil atau awalnya hanya coba-coba? memangnya para pemabuk itu bisa seperti itu prosesnya gimana? awalnya cuman nyicipin doang khan?

JAdi lebih hebat nabi muhammad Dia melarang arak baik sedikit maupun banyak adalah untuk tindakan preventif karena manfaatnya tidak lebih besar dari madarat yang ditimbulkannya. Inilah solusi nabi muhammad jauh lebih baik dari pada solusi ruhul qudus nya ente.
[/quote]
Tepat buat org arab yg gak bisa bedain antara sedikit tapi baik dgn banyak berlebihan dan tidak baik akibatnya.
Menghadapi masyarakat o'on seperti itu memang paling aman ya dilarang total.
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Re: TANTANGAN MUSLIM: BUKTIKAN MUHAMAD SUNAT

Postby kang_erry » 2009 10 05, 8:39

Topik nabi Muhammad Tak Bersunat Sudah terbantah WTC Baca Postingan Saya.

Skr yang jadi masalah adalah Nabi Di Sunat Saat Usia 7 Hari Sedangkan Ishak 8 Hari, Begitu WTC

Bwat Luv: Anda tidak membuktikan apa-apa seharusnya kalau memang Ibrahim yang berkata demikian Musa harus mencantumkan Nama Ibrahim sebagai sumbernya, karena tidak ada kata seperti itu maka Ayat itu bisa berarti ganda: Bisa memang itu ucapan Ibrahim yang di tulis ulang musa bisa juga memang itu perkataan musa khusus Untuk Bani Israel.

Dan itu artinya Bisa jadi masalah teknis hari tidak menjadi wajib, bisa jadi wajibnya hanya Sunatnya saja. Karena kalau hari adalah masalah teknis dan itu wajib, akan banyak orang yang tidak di sunat ketika usia 8 hari karena berbagai hal dan kondisi. Ada berapa tukang Sunat Jaman Ibrahim ? Apakah Setiap Orang Tua Bisa Menyunat Anaknya Sendiri? Seberapa Jauh jangkauan dan mobilitas Tukang Sunat dalam melayani Kaum Ibrahim? ini perkara sepele tapi punya konsekwensi yang besar jika Hari adalah acuan yang tidak bisa fleksibel. Buktinya anda juga merubah Hari Sabat Jadi hari Minggu karena yang penting esensinya BUKAN BEGITU LUV? bukti yg tak terbantahkan anda juga menerapkan theori ini.

Sebenarnya masalah Pemabukan OOT siih tapi Orang yang pinter pinter kaya amrik tuuh mengeluarkan ratusan juta dolar untuk menaggulangi masalah pemabukan. Orang orang yang anda anggap oon hanya dengan 1 Kata DILARANG! gak harus jutaan dolar.
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Re: TANTANGAN MUSLIM: BUKTIKAN MUHAMAD SUNAT

Postby luv_nice » 2009 10 06, 7:32

kang_erry wrote:Topik nabi Muhammad Tak Bersunat Sudah terbantah WTC Baca Postingan Saya.

Skr yang jadi masalah adalah Nabi Di Sunat Saat Usia 7 Hari Sedangkan Ishak 8 Hari, Begitu WTC

Bwat Luv: Anda tidak membuktikan apa-apa seharusnya kalau memang Ibrahim yang berkata demikian Musa harus mencantumkan Nama Ibrahim sebagai sumbernya, karena tidak ada kata seperti itu maka Ayat itu bisa berarti ganda: Bisa memang itu ucapan Ibrahim yang di tulis ulang musa bisa juga memang itu perkataan musa khusus Untuk Bani Israel.

Maksa banget argumennya.
Kitab kejadian ditulis dgn sangat valid, tertulis tokoh2, nama tempat, bahkan kutipan2 verbalnya.
Sekali lagi, apa yg disampaikan Tuhan kepada Abraham dilestarikan dan dilakukan dgn konsisten oleh anak cucunya dr garis Ishak. Bisa jadi krn Ishak memang bertanggungjawab dgn statusnya sbg keturunan Abraham. Kalau ternyata jgnkan tertulis, bahkan secara perbuatan pun Ismael dan keturunannya tidak melestarikan perintah Tuhan itu, ya terimalah sbg realita.

Dan itu artinya Bisa jadi masalah teknis hari tidak menjadi wajib, bisa jadi wajibnya hanya Sunatnya saja.

Artinya, iman sampeyan ttg sunat adalah iman yg berlandaskan kebisajadian. Bisa jadi itulah millah ibrahim, bisa jadi juga bukan. Maka yg pasti tinggal ini: sunatnya muslim adalah millah muhammad.



Karena kalau hari adalah masalah teknis dan itu wajib, akan banyak orang yang tidak di sunat ketika usia 8 hari karena berbagai hal dan kondisi. Ada berapa tukang Sunat Jaman Ibrahim ? Apakah Setiap Orang Tua Bisa Menyunat Anaknya Sendiri? Seberapa Jauh jangkauan dan mobilitas Tukang Sunat dalam melayani Kaum Ibrahim? ini perkara sepele tapi punya konsekwensi yang besar jika Hari adalah acuan yang tidak bisa fleksibel.

Alasan yg maksa juga. kalau persoalannya tidak ada atau sulit cari tukang sunat, maka usia berapapun akan menghadapi persoalan yg sama.



Buktinya anda juga merubah Hari Sabat Jadi hari Minggu karena yang penting esensinya BUKAN BEGITU LUV? bukti yg tak terbantahkan anda juga menerapkan theori ini.

Alasan esensialnya krn kami tidak tunduk pada hukum Taurat, tapi tunduk pada perintah Yesus yg telah lebih dulu menggenapi Taurat.



Sebenarnya masalah Pemabukan OOT siih tapi Orang yang pinter pinter kaya amrik tuuh mengeluarkan ratusan juta dolar untuk menaggulangi masalah pemabukan. Orang orang yang anda anggap oon hanya dengan 1 Kata DILARANG! gak harus jutaan dolar.

Dan tetap saja ada muslim yg jadi pemabuk kan?
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Re: TANTANGAN MUSLIM: BUKTIKAN MUHAMAD SUNAT

Postby Sitikusnari » 2010 01 18, 7:22

Wah, baca debat ini jadi membuka wawasan ane tentang sejarah. Ane jadi makin tahu ketidakkonsistenan PB dan PL, sedangkan Al Qur'an, ane jadi makin yakin...Makasih buat yang debat, terutama buat luv yang udah membuka mata hati ane, bahwa ente hanya mendasarkan pada sejarah yang belum tentu kebenarannya. Kalo dalam referensi ada 1 kesalahan saja, maka ada kemungkinan apa yang tertulis di situ juga tidak luput dari kesalahan. Selamat menjadi pengikut Paulus...Kalo jadi pengikut setia Paulus, jangan ngaku2 jadi pengikut Yesus ya...
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Re: TANTANGAN MUSLIM: BUKTIKAN MUHAMAD SUNAT

Postby raania_islamsejati » 2011 02 22, 9:00

SAYA AKAN MENJWAB PRTNYAAN ANDA DGN SEJELAS MUNGKIN !
Dalam hadits yang di muat di dalam kitab 'at tamhid limaa fi al muwaththa'' karya Abu 'Umar Yusuf bin Abdillah Al Qurthubi menerangkan,
عن ابن عباس "أن عبد المطلب ختن النبي صلى الله عليه ...وسلم يوم سابعه وجعل له مأدبة وسماه محمدا"
Artinya:
dari Ibnu Abbas;
bahwa Abdul Muthtalib (kakek Nabi) mengkhitan Nabi shallallahu 'alaihi wasallam pada hari ke tujuh (kelahiran beliau) dan membuat jamuan makan serta memberi nama dengan Muhammad."
Karena.,di arab, khitan/sunat sudah menjadi tradisi bagi mereka.,,shingga stiap bayi yg baru lahir.,,pda umur ketujuhnya mereka akan dikhitan/disunat, kmudian diakikah, serta diberikan nama..,,
FAHAM???
karena itu..,tidak perlu di pertanyaan sudah ato belum disunatnya orang2 ARAB..,,krn ituw sudah menjadi tradisi di sana..,,terimakasih..,,
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Re: TANTANGAN MUSLIM: BUKTIKAN MUHAMAD SUNAT

Postby gizzmo » 2011 02 23, 2:08

raania_islamsejati wrote:SAYA AKAN MENJWAB PRTNYAAN ANDA DGN SEJELAS MUNGKIN !
Dalam hadits yang di muat di dalam kitab 'at tamhid limaa fi al muwaththa'' karya Abu 'Umar Yusuf bin Abdillah Al Qurthubi menerangkan,
عن ابن عباس "أن عبد المطلب ختن النبي صلى الله عليه ...وسلم يوم سابعه وجعل له مأدبة وسماه محمدا"
Artinya:
dari Ibnu Abbas;
bahwa Abdul Muthtalib (kakek Nabi) mengkhitan Nabi shallallahu 'alaihi wasallam pada hari ke tujuh (kelahiran beliau) dan membuat jamuan makan serta memberi nama dengan Muhammad."
Karena.,di arab, khitan/sunat sudah menjadi tradisi bagi mereka.,,shingga stiap bayi yg baru lahir.,,pda umur ketujuhnya mereka akan dikhitan/disunat, kmudian diakikah, serta diberikan nama..,,
FAHAM???
karena itu..,tidak perlu di pertanyaan sudah ato belum disunatnya orang2 ARAB..,,krn ituw sudah menjadi tradisi di sana..,,terimakasih..,,


Bagaimana...Luv...WTC...sudah jelaskan ini..?
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Re: TANTANGAN MUSLIM: BUKTIKAN MUHAMAD SUNAT

Postby njlajahweb » 2017 08 02, 11:17

sekilasInfo
http://www.laskarislam.com/t10322-lagu- ... kekosongan

http://www.laskarislam.com/t10479-sekil ... ht=sekilas

http://www.laskarislam.com/t10343-tenta ... +berkaitan

http://www.laskarislam.com/t10344-video ... =bela+diri

http://www.laskarislam.com/t10335-ajal- ... =ajal+bisa

http://www.laskarislam.com/t10321-info- ... bermanfaat

===
http://www.laskarislam.com/t10402p200-y ... han#203721
http://www.laskarislam.com/t10125p250-j ... h-satu-itu
http://www.laskarislam.com/t9769p275-sh ... ar-kristen

http://www.laskarislam.com/t8722p450-ul ... hammad-saw

http://www.laskarislam.com/t1630p275-an ... matius-ini
http://www.laskarislam.com/t2865p225-pe ... upun-islam
http://www.laskarislam.com/t9674p475-sh ... lalu-benar
---
Qs 23:101 Apabila sangkakala ditiup maka tidaklah ada lagi pertalian nasab di antara mereka pada hari itu, dan tidak ada pula mereka saling bertanya. 102 Barangsiapa yang berat timbangan (kebaikan)nya, maka mereka itulah orang-orang yang dapat keberuntungan. 103 Dan barangsiapa yang ringan timbangannya, maka mereka itulah orang-orang yang merugikan dirinya sendiri, mereka kekal di dalam neraka Jahannam.

Matius 13:49 Demikianlah juga pada akhir zaman: Malaikat-malaikat akan datang memisahkan orang jahat dari orang benar,
13:50 lalu mencampakkan orang jahat ke dalam dapur api; di sanalah akan terdapat ratapan dan kertakan gigi.

---
ajal itu tak pandang bulu, apakah orang kesayangan atau tidak, apakah dalam kandungan atau tidak, apakah masih kecil atau besar, apakah masih muda atau tua, apakah masih sehat atau tidak, ajal bisa menjemput kapan saja, bisa hari ini, bisa hari esok ajal menjemput, bisa tanpa diduga, bisa juga tanpa permisi.
---
Tuhan Yesus memberkati
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Re: TANTANGAN MUSLIM: BUKTIKAN MUHAMAD SUNAT

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